Restoration
Hey Everyone.  I have read though many of the posts on here, and they have been really helpful for the past few months.  I thought I would share all of this, even though it won't apply to most people.  There is a Peyronie's Disease (PD) board out there, but there's not really a progress section there & they don't discuss reconstruction / PMMA / size restoration...and  my posts (after today) will be about getting my size back (unless people have PD questions, I am happy to answer).   I can't get PMMA for a few months until I am healed from surgery, but I definitely want to do it...and I will likely do traction to get back to where I started (or more if it's possible).

Before reading this board, I was not even sure I wanted to get surgery to fix the PD I had because I sort of thought my dick was a lost cause.  I was incredibly depressed over what Peyronie's disease did - and I never thought it was possible to get back to normal.  This was one of the shittiest things that I've dealt with and I am surprised I am even posting about it in detail online bc of how sensitive of an issue it has been...but maybe there's value in this to some people.  If Miracle8x7 hadn't posted what he did, I'd still be where I was a year ago - miserable w/ no hope of improvement.  Every day, urologists tell people with PD that they have no hope of improvement...it's really not true.  Though honestly, every treatment failed over a 4 year period, I did not want to risk surgery.  After reading posts here, I realized I might actually have chance at some kind of meaningful recovery if I got things started with surgery like Miracle did. 

Since I have a lot of pics - I'll walk through my back story in a couple of posts, so the pics are sort of "in-line" with what I'm talking about without getting too jumbled, hopefully.

Anyway, I started off with a reasonable penis - about 6.5 EL x 4.5.  I always thought it was thin (well, it was thin) but it wasn't something I was that concerned about since the options at the time (fat, alloderm) weren't reliable and were very very expensive. This pics attached to this post were the starting point - before any PD symptoms. I had a curve (since puberty) of maybe 10 degrees.  There was no plaque here - this is not PD yet.



Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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Restoration
Around 2008 - I noticed that I had a lot of turtling...and I would be sitting and feel my dick completely crawl up inside me. It was weird.  I stopped waking up with morning wood.  I only got 60-80% hard when masturbating. These were issues I should have paid attention to, but I wrote all of this up to stress, aging, and use of sleeping pills.  The size and shape never started to change until 2010, when I noticed dents on either side, practically overnight.   I also started to feel ridges...which I depicted in the pic below.  Back then, I had no clue what PD was.  I emailed these pics to a urologist I saw on TV because Ithought I had a cosmetic case, and this urologist was on Dr. 90210 (Dr. Alter) - I really just thought I developed some strange dents.  He told me that was probably PD, and I should see a doctor in person. 

You can get an idea of what Peyronie's did to me in about a year in the pic below.  This was before any treatments.

1a.jpg 1bb.jpg 

Medical protocols are constantly changing, and most urologists insist that you need to wait a year before doing anything bc the disease can progress & treatments (like surgery) will have to be redone.  Most people stabilize after a year. These days, they should give you trental to slow the inflammation and possibly reverse the disease, though it is not a miracle pill for anyone really.  Since I had about a year of symptoms, I was able to start verapamil injections with a urologist trained by one of the top PD specialists...though I do not think his technique was the same.  Also, traction was recommended.  I bought a traction device, and I was able to get back to about 6" (which I would repeatedly lose and gain back over 4 years - my tunica had thickened - as I was told after surgery - so that explained why traction wasn't as easy for me).    

I spent about 6 months getting verapamil injections, and I wanted to post pictures of the swelling because some of it (particularly the circ scar swelling) is similar to what some of you put in your PMMA journals.  This was mostly just saline, but the penis responds similarly sometimes (and these injections were rough because they stab the plaque repeatedly).  The photos are from different injection days over the 6 month period - not progress pics.  I had no benefit from these treatments at all. Most people do not benefit.  This is the protocol for the injections my doctor followed:

A standardized dose of 10 mg of verapamil (5 mg/2 cc) diluted to 10 cc total volume with injectable saline is used. The solution is distributed throughout the Peyronie's plaque using a 5/8-inch, 25-gauge needle on a standard 10 cc Luerlock syringe. A smaller gauge needle is not recommended, as this may increase the risk of needle fracture. Also, the 25-gauge needle allows for a large enough tract in which to deposit the drug. Prior to drug injection, a penile block is performed with 10 cc 0.5% bupivacaine without epinephrine. In some cases, a second penile block may be required. The plaque is grasped between index finger and thumb, and a single skin puncture is performed. The needle is then passed in and out of the plaque while leaving the drug within the needle tracts. In men with large plaques, the needle may be removed and the process repeated


2a.jpg

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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Restoration
At this point, verapamil had failed completely...and I was out of options other than surgery.  I heard about the Xiaflex trial (collagenase enzyme to dissolve the plaque via injection), but it filled up with patients already.  So, I thought I would wait for Xiaflex to be approved before risking surgery while using traction and taking Trental.  During the 3 years I waited, my plaques virtually disappeared.  However, my curve and narrowing got much worse.  My ED got worse. My doctor also said I was no longer a candidate for xiaflex (there was nowhere to inject since the plaques were gone).  The damage had been done by PD.  PD destroys elastin too, and it can also scar your septum, where xiaflex cannot be injected... maybe if Xiaflex was already out in 2010, I could have been saved from surgery - but this was not an option.  It was only available to plastic surgeons who did hand surgery - and they could not use it off label.  It would have cost 26k to use it off label anyway (with no guarantee of success)...so I was not able to get it off label.  

This is how the PD progressed up until the surgery.  Psychologically, this messed with me pretty bad.  Imagine 3.7" girth...  

ddd.jpg 

There are 3 surgeries available to people with Peyronie's Disease.  I had # 1. 

1.  Plication / Nesbit / Modified Nesbit / 16 Dot
These all have the same principle with slightly different approaches.  They shorten the longer side.  The damage in my penis was mostly on top...so the top shortened by PD to 5.2" but the bottom was still 6" or so.  Hence, it curved.  So, by tucking / cutting small ellipses of tissue from the bottom and suturing them together, you get a straight penis.  You don't really risk ED or sensation loss.  You do risk size loss.  I lost 0.5 cm.  I might be able to get it back with traction.

2.  Grafting
This is what Miracle8x7 had.  You need to have strong erections going into grafting surgery because the risk of ED is significant, and I did not have good erectile quality at all.  Also, you need a well defined plaque to excise.  Finally, you need a VERY good surgeon or you can risk sensation loss, size loss (it happens with grafting too) and ED.  It's much more complicated than plication.  It takes 2x as long in the operating room, at least.  The other thing is that my damaged tissue was on top, right under the neurovascular bundle.  This is the riskiest area of the penis to deal with - so doing grafting right below that risks sensation loss more than in other areas.  This is the most common area for plaque, so surgeons know how to deal with the nerves...but it's still a bigger risk than plication.

3.  Penile implant
This is the point of no return...once you do this, you can never have natural erections for the rest of your life.  Since these need to be replaced every 10 years or so, I was looking at 3-5 implants for the rest of my life...and never having a natural erection again.  They do help fill out your girth and restore some size, especially when combined with grafting...but it all depends on where your damage is and how bad it is.  You could lose a lot of length with these too.

I went for plication for 2 main reasons.  1 - you can see my entire penis starts to get narrower in the entire shaft - over time.  I did not have 1 localized narrow segment that could be repaired.  A surgeon cannot remove tissue from the entire length of the penis without a huge chance of ED.  There was a possibility that I may have had to have a very large excision.  If I had grafting in 2011, it might have been successful at restoring girth...though it's hard to say because my disease progressed.  2 - I had ED.  I had a 5/10 erection anytime I did not take viagra. In the last year, viagra only got me to 8/10.   I am not happy I lost even more size, but fortunately it was limited to 0.5 cm.  In a perfect world, I would have had grafting surgery and regained girth and length, but the ED risk seemed too high. I still  wonder if I did the wrong thing.  Maybe I only had a small area of scar tissue (my last ultrasound showed a tiny plaque) - and if it was taken out - everything would be normal.  My doctor didn't seem to agree...and he has done 100s of these cases.   After reading this board & learning about PMMA, I figured I could just do plication and then get PMMA to get my girth back.  Traction may help with length.

Here's how things are now...by the way, this was the most painful experience I have ever gone through - and I broke my nose and jaw (and had surgery on both with screws in my jaw).  No amount of norco even helped me.  I started taking gabapentin with norco and soma and that seemed to at least make me somewhat ok...but I was basically in a constant state of feeling like my dick was being skinned alive for a few days.  It still hurts at the incision line, mostly.  I know I get erections at night now because I wake up in some serious pain every time they happen.  I have no sensation loss, and the swelling didn't linger too much past day 10, though it will take 4-6 weeks to be normal...and maybe 6 months not to have pain.  I am scared that I will have pain on erections due to the internal knots, but I can't worry about it too much now.  Here's the latest pic:

lastPic.jpg

So...from here... I need to heal up and start using traction after 4-6 weeks post op.  Then, in about 4-6 months, I can start PMMA.  

Anyway, if you have any questions, I'd be happy to answer them.  I've really gone through 4 years of hell and was stuck there until I started reading this board.  It might sound like I am putting too much faith in PMMA - but it is the ONLY thing that offered any hope in the last 4 years of total misery & having every doctor tell me my dick is "normal" and "average" - and just deal with it (which is bs - 4" girth is not average).  So anyway, this board makes me feel normal too - since some of you crazy dudes START with 5.5" girth and want PMMA to be 7" [crazy] but that's fine.  I want a big(er) dick again & that's why I'm here. The 4 year nightmare is over...I lost a huge chunk of my life (and dick) and am still single because of it... and now it's time to get back to normal.  Woo hoo.  I feel like I just wrote a research paper.

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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hoddle10
Sounds like you've had a rough time of it. Thanks very much for sharing your story and I'm sure it will be useful to many of our members. I've got a similar curve due to scar tissue from removal of fat, but mine is at the base, so it isn't so bad. I have a very high erection angle because of it, but it's much better to have it there than at the end of the penis. 

Good luck with your recovery.
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dcpimpin12

hoddle i sent u a pm bro

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Restoration
Thanks hoodle.  Have you been looking into getting rid of the bend or are u ok with it?  Some bends will respond to traction and pentoxifyline, but it's not a magic bullet at all...sometimes it helps with EQ / ED and gives a little progress w/ the bend.

I really hope the story is useful (sorry it was so wordy)!   It took a while to find all the pics, resize them / line them up, write the story - but it's worth it if it helps people in the same way Miracle's posts helped me.  I PMed SkepticalOne that you guys are amazing at keeping trolls out - or I'd never ever post this kind of personal stuff.  It's really a sensitive issue and I've been incredibly depressed over it...so thanks to you too!

I'll update when I'm further healed too...it's looking ok - the scab is stubbornly hanging on, and I don't think any sutures dissolved...and boners HURT - but it's still early days.

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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Miracle8x7
Restoration,

Sounds like you too have been through hell.  I had grafting with Dr. Paulo Egydio and it restored my length and girth.  There are photos in my PR.  So happy you're recovered and sharing your experience.  Best wishes in achieving your goals.

M8
Never gonna retire from PE! What? You gotta problem with dat?

Progress Report
http://phalloboards.websitetoolbox.com/post/Miracle8x7s-PMMA-Progress-Report-5391236
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Restoration
Thanks Miracle.  I would not be here if it weren't for your posts and this board. I seriously had 0 hope of ever getting back to normal - and partly bc the docs would say "you won't look like you did before".  Egydio gave you incredible results.  You must have been so happy.  I have a mild regret about not getting a graft, but the issue of ED was always raised when I mentioned grafting.  So, plication was the only option left since I did not want an implant.

Now, I have perfectly fine erections (but it's supposedly altered during the post-op phase & things are more sensitive) so I really wonder if I could have gotten a graft.   I should have asked my surgeon to go in and just make the decision when he was in full view the tissue.  It was very hard to determine, in the office, just how much plaque I had vs. how much tunical thickening & inelasticity I had.  My plaque was most present in the first 2 years & started to thin out to the point that we weren't sure there was enough to graft. It also went in the septum...we think.  

How did you get so much length back?

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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smalljay
Wow man, this was one of the most interesting and tragic threads I've ever read. I never really sat down and thought about Peyronies being what it is - a disease that will basically eat your dick alive. Thank you for posting this, because apparently up to 9% of men will develop Peyronies and most develop it during middle age, so that aint peanuts. Some of us here may have to look to threads like this by you and Miracle in the future, to try and find solutions if we ever develop it.

Your struggle must have been unimaginably hard, but I'm happy that at the very least you had the hope of PMMA to help you hold on for as long as you did. I can SOMEWHAT relate (of course not to the degree that you've gone through), but just in the sense that it seems that this may have put your life on hold for a very long time. Even without peyronies I feel that I'm in the same boat, but PMMA and other procedures (like the Lipen D glans enhancement) have been some of the only things to keep me going. I've had a long term jelqing nerve injury, and learned that manual PE was just not for me. When I learned that my dick was too sensitive and injury prone to PE, I was devastated because I thought there really was no solution for me.

I happened to come across a post from SkepticalOne over at Thundersplace, and after a quck PM session I found this place, and damn I am so glad I sent that PM to him. Suicide was genuinely my next step, and finding a site like this has helped me hold on to life for over a year since then, clinging to the hope of healing from my injury (which I am, slowly), stretching to gain some length and finally getting PMMA. It's a sort of 3 year plan I had in the beginning, and until then I've been living the life of a hermit. So in that small sense I feel I understand at least how your life has been downgraded and put on hold because of this, to some extent at least.

I feel for you very much and have faith that you will be able to gain length (girth isn't even a question - you're gonna have a fat dick one day!). There are so many great reports of length gains, one of the best cases is on this site and I'm sure you've read it (New1Inch's thread). There are so many methods to try and if one fails, just move onto the other. Manual stretching seems to be one of the most successful methods, even if it does sound the most 'mellow'. I feel that this mellowness is one of the reasons that it is successful on many people. Of course traction devices work for many, but I'm a less is more guy and my dick injures easily. So manual stretching will be the first thing I try since so many of the best documented success stories used ONLY manual stretching (New1Inch here, Bennett8 over at Thunder'sPlace, and many, many others that I can't think of now). If that fails, I'd suggest moving onto very light hanging (via glans attachment like the VacADS, not the Bib which may inflame your peyronies). It appears you already tried traction and seems like you couldn't get consistent gains with it, that's why I didn't mention using extender devices. But Manual Stretching should be the 'easiest' on your dick especially after a painful surgery like the one you've already had, and your Peyronie's condition.

I wish the best for you man and hope you keep fighting through time to your eventual, inevitable happiness. I already know you are an incredibly strong guy with immeasurable mental fortitude, to be able to last through a misery like that where your dick was literally eaten alive with little hope of solution for over a 4 year period. Now, you know that there is a solution for girth (PMMA), a solution for glans enhancement on the way (it's here already in Korea), and you know that length gains are very, very possible. What you should focus on now is a LONG TERM healing period...just a little longer...the hard 4 year wait is over and now I feel that maybe you have just a couple years to go at the most. I'd let that thing heal from surgery for at least 6 months to 1 year before I started stretching...but it's up to you and how it feels to you. But let that thing heal up and I'm confident you are on your way to an even better dick than before. Hang in there bro and keep fighting.
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Restoration
Hey SmallJay - Sorry I didn't even notice your post until now.  Thanks a lot for writing that.  I really appreciate it - especially now that I just had some insane stuff happen today that I posted about in the love/lust forum - so my fortitude you mentioned was tested alot.  We sorta did go through the same things.  Miracle's posts had the same effect on me that SO's had on you...I was pretty much at the end before I read his stuff.  Btw, when you mentioned stretching rather than traction - I actually didn't know there was a difference.  Is stretching the same as the bib hanger?  They said I could do traction at 6 weeks but it hurt like a bitch so I stopped... and some size already came back on its own - just post op retraction that released...etc...Anyway, I wanted to post another update today because I took some post op pics.  I'll take some better ones when my camera is charged fully (too hard to do with phone - need timer). 

It looks like there was more shortening than there really was... because they took a lot of length off the bottom (the top had already been scarred about 1" I lost) - so it looks shorter.  Miracle8 has similar pics posted in his log... his results are a little better on the length side because he had a graft, but I had ED and was not a candidate for a graft - they thought at the time.  I question it now, but it's over with.  Also, not everyone who gets a graft will regain size...it's a very odd disease.  

Time will tell if I can get more length back - there are a lot of sutures and knots under my dick - so stretching suture material is probably impossible, though the tissue might still move.  The tisuse on top is thickened from peyronie's (my doctor said post op) so that's partially why it won't stretch well.  That doesn't mean it's hopeless...it just might take me 2x as long.

Anyway, here's a before and after - I'll take clearer ones soon.  I have to use a timer to get the side view, and my camera never focuses right with that.  I have some top ones I need to do side by side.

Before-and-After-Plication.jpg

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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smalljay
Just read your Love Lust and Vanity post...yeah man, after PMMA you won't get comments like that. Girth has so much to do with how turned on someone gets when they grab your dick and also how big it's perceived...and you've got adequate length. We're both near the same length stats - both where if we gained a little bit more, we'd be technically above average (you may already be there now, and definitely were in the past). But from what I've read here and at Thunders (at least in the straight world, lets hope gay dudes can at least be somewhat nice), if your cock is thick, you'll get compliments. I've seen that from below 5" length and up through the average range...guys get PMMA and their partners call them 'thick' or 'big'. Now, this might not be saying 'wow you have the biggest best cock ever', but once your dick has at least SOME exceptional attribute about it, that will turn people on all the more and people like to praise where praise is due. Me, I've never got that as I'm average length at best and below average girth. Rather, I've always gotten either no comments or vague comments like 'it's really hard' or the 'filtered' small comments that someone else posted in your other thread (girls telling you you're thin or kinda small in a 'nice way'). After PMMA, even if I know the next girl is just stroking my ego, if I hear a woman tell me something like 'wow you're thick' or 'wow it's big' like some of the other dudes my size have received...even if I know it's partly to make me feel good, I'll still take that and feel amazing about it. It's definitely better than no reaction at all or a negative comment.

BTW, I think the dumb dude's comment (guy with shorter dick than you who called your dick 'small') was more angled at your girth than your length. You seemed to focus on your length a lot in that post but to be honest at length your dick can look generally big with PMMA (for instance, take a look at Notdoneyet82's progress report, or DanceswithDragons - both near our length and look how they came out looking after. I feel DWD looked superb after his first session (5.5" girth) myself, definitely 'big' by most standards. Just be grateful we live in a time where we can fix that problem...the future is unknown but I'd rather roll the dice than not live my youth how I want. Also, keep in mind the mental relief that having a well hung flaccid all the time will bring you. Most people see a consistent 1" - 1.5" flaccid length gain. Fuck yeah. So worst comes to worst (assuming our dicks stay healthy for a long time with PMMA), you don't gain any length for whatever reason but you get a fat one and a nice flaccid out of the deal. And glans enhancement if you want it. More than what a lot of people get.

As for manual stretching, yes, it is different than traction. Traction is controlled stretching via a device for a prolonged period of time (usually hours per day with small breaks every so often). Manual stretching should be much easier on your dick. They consist of a warmup, preferably via 4-5 min under Infra Red lamp at least a foot and a half away from your dick (should also help speed your surgery recovery as well - IR lamps promote deep tissue healing/bloodflow when used in moderation). After this warmup you grip your dick just behind the head with an upside down 'OK' grip and pull out - not to where it hurts or is uncomfortable, but just enough to get a good stretch. Hold this for 30 seconds (I actually plan to do only 15 seconds at first - my dick is sensitive). You do it in 5 'reps', so one 15-30 'mississippi' second stretch each direction - straight out (rest) up (rest) down (rest) left (rest) right. Or you can do all 5 reps in one direction if you want - down seems to be the most effective, as that's the angle a lot of hangers gain with initially. Between each set you want about 15 - 30 seconds of rest, try lightly helicoptering your dick between each set or just a gentle shake to get the blood back in between each stretch.  I only tried this routine once briefly during my jelqing injury, but had to stop because the jelq injury kept getting worse (I was still jelqing as well). During that time though, I did measure ~1/8" non bone pressed larger than I ever have - and I measure consistently and accurately, the same way every time (look at a ruler, 1/8" is bigger than you think). This of course went away when I stopped, but I have hope that I will at least be able to gain .5" from it. New1Inch gained a full inch w picture proof in well under a year just with these types of stretches (although he claims that he 'tugged the shit' out of his dick, aka pulled very hard. I would not personally recommend that but then again my dick is very sensitive and not as thick and durable as New1Inch's). In fact, when I went too hard with the stretches I found that my flaccid and erect length actually retracted a bit - only when I lightened up and treated it like how I would stretch any other body part - hamstrings etc - gently yet progressively, smart and steady with a proper warm up - only then did I see results (mind you I got these gains in less than a month). Manual stretches are what is included in most newbie routines. Although I think newbie routines are dangerous - jelqs fucked me up, I do see people reporting length gains all the time from manual stretching alone.

For future reference, here's one of the best examples of manual stretching only gains from Thundersplace (also check out New1inch's thread), but here it is, a thread by Bennett8. You'll need to log in to see the pictures, I recommend joining if you aren't a member but be careful not to step in the bullshit, as there's a lot of it floating around over there (guys gaining 1"+ girth in 2 months...come on...). But picture threads like this one and many others are very helpful: http://www.thundersplace.org/progress-reports-and-pictures/2-inch-growth-comparative-pictures.html


This guy's gains are also great, although not solely from manual stretching. He pumped and jelqed a lot but attributes a lot of his length to manual stretches. The first two pics in his first post are pretty incredible length differences: http://www.thundersplace.org/progress-reports-and-pictures/skus-picture-progress-log.html


Edit: btw if size is coming back on it's own, I'd keep resting and just let it. Don't aggravate things by rushing it...let time take its course. Heal up, then stretch - you don't want a painful dick at the end of all this! Also, I highly recommend ceasing all use of the bib hanger with your condition...clamping down on the shaft like that CANNOT be good for the surgery/peyronies condition you just underwent. I recommend something that attaches to the glans like a Vac ADS or TheGrip System or the LG hanger (I'm sure there are others, I just can't think of the names. Those three are pretty popular though). Should be much easier on your unit...not telling you what to do but most guys suggest maxing out your gains with manual stretches first, and once those gains stall, THEN move up to the more progressive PE method of hanging.
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Restoration
SmallJay - thanks a ton man - that was really helpful.  I feel like an idiot for thinking stretching and traction were the same thing.  Well, I definitely agree girth is going to affect the perception of "size" - i mean nobody with 6.25 bpel x 5.5 eg would be said to have  "the smallest dick I've ever seen in my life" - so yea, girth was definitely an issue here.  4.25 is just way too small...i feel like I deserve to be done with all this for going through all the crap I did - but nope - back to square 1 really.  Oddly enough, I had 4 years w/ the same size (AND major curve) - and nobody ran out of my place with an emotional breakdown...though this was someone in their 20s with limited experience w/ guys.  Anyway, so I basically have to gain a full inch of girth from PMMA or even more.  I guess that's possible from other posters experiences.  It is just a long ass waiting period.  Notsureyet & DWD have awesome journey threads - so yeah, there's definitely hope on the horizon.  New1inch also did a good job....though like you said he's got more resilience there than either of us do probably.  My urologist wants to see me 4 months post, and hopefully he'll say everything is ok - then maybe i'll push up Dr. C a month.  It's not like Dr. C can hurt anything to my knowledge - he's going on a different plane entirely (in the fascia - not on the tunica).  It might aggravate the healing though to have all the swelling there again.  Dr. C thought 3 months is fine.

The stretches you described are actually not even that different from the stretches my doctor asked me to do post op after 6 weeks.  He is against JelQs and stuff, and he didn't say to use the ok grip (i did thunders beginner routine years ago - or maybe it was a peyronies routine i found on there) - but doing the different angles & making sure you gave it some time, etc... is all what he wanted so I didn't retract even more from the surgery.  I still have swelling & pain, even this far out - so I'll be on the beginner's lightweight plan for now.  Mild stretching is ok...they said traction at 6 weeks was ok even....but it hasn't been comfortable at all.  Thanks for that link.  I don't really have pain normally, but after an orgasm it can be annoying as hell for up to a full day.  It's getting on my nerves this far post.

Here's a few other questions:

- Is there a infared lamp you'd recommend or PE guys use?  I looked on amazon and the one that looks convenient is $100 because it has a base...but it's kinda expensive.   Another set of lamps have bad reviews or are handheld which would be hard to use evenly while stretching.  I think it could help w/ the healing process, so I'd definitely get one.
- Do you need lube for the stretches u described?  (I kinda hate using lube cuz it's more of a mess).
- Are you supposed to be totally flaccid or have a semi?  

- I havent found a clear answer on the board & might need to make it a separate post, but is lengthening an option post PMMA via stretching?  It looks like Miracle still got length after this.  I can't figure it out if it would thin out the PMMA results or something.  I assume a noose traction device would create a  dent.

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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jlmb
I want to reiterate what smalljay said about 'perceived size'. Before PMMA when I was at 7.5x4.75 or whatever I sheldom got comments that my dick was big. It was above average in length yeah, but length is sorta pretty subjective to measure visually and 'feel', and since my girth was on the low size it gave me a 'smaller' feel.

Now that my flaccid girth alone is pretty close to 6" my dick has a huge fat look and feel before anything even gets started, it riles up the other person in a big dick mindset and thats the perception of it after. As long as you're not below average in length I think the perception is just big and fat, not short and chubby. Additionally volume wise a thicker dick is gonna often be bigger than a longer one.
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smalljay
^Thanks for that input jlmb. I too noticed that when I went to The Visualizer site (where you can see a visual representation of your dick size)...I was actually a bit longer than 'Mr. Medium' (5.5" length and average girth), but was dissapointed to find out that Mr. Medium had me beat by a significant amount of volume (I have below average girth)....how dare he have more volume than me [mad] wtf lol

To answer your questions Restoration:

- I use the Philips Par 38 150 Watt/230 Volt...do a google search, I had to order it from Europe but it was a bit cheaper than $100 and is a larger, better lamp than the handheld one that you mentioned (although if you got the handheld, I'm sure that will work as well). However I recommend the one I purchased...I then went to Walmart and bought one of those cheap desk lamps that clamps onto the edge of a desk and has a flexible 'arm' that moves the lamp head around. The lamp head was JUST large enough to fit my Par 38 inside of it and powers it just fine. Also, with manual stretching you don't need to have the IR lamp on your dick during the stretch (in fact, I recommend against this). At most I'd say just use it to warm up your junk before hand for about 5 minutes. While it does promote healing, it can also cause skin burns if you leave it on too long (aka during an entire stretching work out) and also if you have it too close. You also have your testicles to think about - avoid over exposure to your balls if you can. Some people wrap tin foil (I think) around them to help block the rays, but I've seen no ill effects from using it ~5 minutes before each workout without wrapping my balls up like I'm preparing for an alien invasion. But it's sort of like tanning...respect it and use it in moderation, keep a good distance between your junk and the lamp and limit your warm up time to 5 minutes. Then shut it off, and stretch.

- I would think lube would make the stretching more difficult, as your 'okay grip' behind/on the edge of the glans would likely keep slipping off. Whatever makes your stretch more comfortable though.

- Stretch totally flaccid - never even remotely semi or hard - this will cause damage. Some guys have a problem staying soft when stretching (especially after getting a good warm up with infra red). A tiny bit of engorgement due to warmed up tissues is okay (aka stretching with a 'good' flaccid, one of your lower hanging ones). However if your dick is starting to stand straight out due to a semi, I'd back off until I got flaccid again. If you start to get hard after one of your stretches, let it go back down to flaccid.


- Some guys have reported length gains after PMMA. Big John is one that comes to mind. It would be unlikely to thin your PMMA results but from what I've heard, PMMA can make gaining length more difficult at least in theory. I spoke with Skeptical One about this and he told me that if he could do it again or go back, he would have tried to lengthen before he got many cc's of 30% PMMA beads pumped into his unit. It's our own collagen sure, but it's also like an implant in that it used to not be there and now it is - I would think PMMA might hinder your ability to gain by making your dick more thick and robust. Other people who have had PMMA have shared this view, but then again others have gained afterwards. But it is generally recommended around here to try for length first.
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Restoration
Well, time flies.  It's getting close.

I took some before pics.  I might post everything later... with new pics bc these aren't great...and I don't like the way it looks.   First, my curve came back 10-15 degrees which my doctor warned me about on day 1 anyway and said is normal.  Nevertheless, it still hurts at the stupid plicaiton nodes (where they basically stitched the bottom of my dick together so it wouldn't curve) mostly after orgasm...and there's no way to touch those nodes once I am post PMMA. I think I just have an ugly dick... It looked good when it was 100% straight and still swollen from surgery and all uniform.  Now it's thinner and curved again (which a lot of guys are - but it looked best straight and smoother).  Maybe I'll feel better if the PMMA goes well. 

I don't know what to do about this whole 10/30 thing.  JimmyJames and JohnThomas both have journals that make me very concerned though BrunoXXX and Honzeee and oberc looked very good (though oberc did better after r2).  

My measurements are a little hard to pin down depending on how I measure and the EQ (and some curve is back which adds to the complexity), but here's the latest.

On 10 mg cialis:
Neck Girth (where peyronies damaged the tissue - you can feel it when erect): 4 1/8"
Base Girth (where it feels normal): 4 1/2" 
BPEL with ruler on top & penis curved: 6.0 -or- 6.5 if I bend it so the curve is gone. It's almost 7 if i put the ruler on the side, but I think that's the cheating way to do it. Regardless, all that matters is the change (if there even is one) - so I want to be consistent.
NBPEL measured from top left: 5.5-6.0 but I need to loose 15 lbs.  This is measured w/o unbending the curve.

I might do all of these measurements again w/ viagra and centimeters... I don't know... I want more reliable stats.

Anyway...it's coming up... and I'm not quite "excited" - just kinda feeling like I did before other surgeries I've had...nervous isnt the right word - more like ... why am I in this casino... why do I have to be in this damn casino?

Btw - thanks for the above posts... I didn't notice this earlier.  Yeah overall size/volume has so much to do with perceived size vs. just length.

plication-progress.png


girth.jpg bpel.jpg

Part 1:  The first year - recovering 1/2" girth lost to Peyronie's Disease (Round 1 & 2 Metacrill PMMA)
Part 2:  Things starting to go bad (I had nodules removed and excisions wouldn't heal)  (After Round 3)
Part 3: Resolving Round 3 problems caused entirely by USA doctors.
Part 4: All PMMA (from all 3 rounds) hardened 6-12 months after round 3.

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